777 Malaysia (MH17) AMS-KUL cade in Ucraina al confine con la Russia
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Dutch search team recovers remains, MH17 wreckage in Ukraine
(Reuters) - A Dutch search team recovered human remains and wreckage from the crash site of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 in eastern Ukraine on Monday, the Dutch government said.
The plane was shot down on July 17, killing 298 passengers and crew, two-thirds of them Dutch. Forensics teams in the Netherlands have so far identified 295 victims with DNA testing.
Dutch military and police officials, working with the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE), found body parts near the town of Grabovo, close to the main crash site, a statement said.
"They recovered personal belongings and some pieces of wreckage that were found by residents," it said. The team planned to continue the search in nearby villages if the security situation in coming days permits.
Fighting between government forces and pro-Russian rebels has surged in recent days after failed peace talks.
A Dutch-led, international investigation into how the plane was brought down is ongoing. It is widely believed to have been shot down by a ground-to-air missile fired from territory held by pro-Russian insurgents.
(Reuters) - A Dutch search team recovered human remains and wreckage from the crash site of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 in eastern Ukraine on Monday, the Dutch government said.
The plane was shot down on July 17, killing 298 passengers and crew, two-thirds of them Dutch. Forensics teams in the Netherlands have so far identified 295 victims with DNA testing.
Dutch military and police officials, working with the Organisation for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE), found body parts near the town of Grabovo, close to the main crash site, a statement said.
"They recovered personal belongings and some pieces of wreckage that were found by residents," it said. The team planned to continue the search in nearby villages if the security situation in coming days permits.
Fighting between government forces and pro-Russian rebels has surged in recent days after failed peace talks.
A Dutch-led, international investigation into how the plane was brought down is ongoing. It is widely believed to have been shot down by a ground-to-air missile fired from territory held by pro-Russian insurgents.
Investigators Inspect MH17 Wreckage At Dutch Air Base
February 20, 2015
Investigators looking into the downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine in July 2014 met for their first joint consultation this week, examining cracks and impact patterns on the jet's fuselage, Dutch officials said.
The Boeing 777 was flying from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur with 298 passengers and crew onboard when it crashed with no prior warning over the front lines of Ukraine's conflict between Moscow-backed separatist and Kiev government forces.
Parts of the aircraft were taken to the Netherlands late last year because heavy fighting between pro-Russian separatist rebels and Ukrainian government forces had for months prevented safe inspection of the crash site in the country's east.
"In the past week the (team) conducted several investigations of the wreckage, including the fractures, failure mechanisms and impact patterns," the Dutch Safety Board said in a statement.
Investigators will soon begin a three-dimensional reconstruction of parts of the aircraft at the Dutch air force base where the wreckage is stored, the Board said, adding that relatives of victims would be able to visit in early March.
In an initial report, Dutch investigators assessed that the airliner's fuselage was pierced by "high energy objects" - which could have come from the ground or the air. Prosecutors have said they are open to both possibilities but think it more likely the aircraft was shot down from the ground.
The Netherlands is leading the criminal and air safety investigations into the disaster, since more than two thirds the victims were Dutch. Investigators from Ukraine, Malaysia, Australia, Britain, Belgium and Germany are also taking part.
A spokesman said the safety board's draft report into the circumstances of the MH17 crash would probably be ready after the summer, at which point the other countries involved could make their own submissions.
The Dutch team will be under no obligation to change its report even if another country's authorities disagreed radically with its conclusions, the spokesman said.
(Reuters)
February 20, 2015
Investigators looking into the downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine in July 2014 met for their first joint consultation this week, examining cracks and impact patterns on the jet's fuselage, Dutch officials said.
The Boeing 777 was flying from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur with 298 passengers and crew onboard when it crashed with no prior warning over the front lines of Ukraine's conflict between Moscow-backed separatist and Kiev government forces.
Parts of the aircraft were taken to the Netherlands late last year because heavy fighting between pro-Russian separatist rebels and Ukrainian government forces had for months prevented safe inspection of the crash site in the country's east.
"In the past week the (team) conducted several investigations of the wreckage, including the fractures, failure mechanisms and impact patterns," the Dutch Safety Board said in a statement.
Investigators will soon begin a three-dimensional reconstruction of parts of the aircraft at the Dutch air force base where the wreckage is stored, the Board said, adding that relatives of victims would be able to visit in early March.
In an initial report, Dutch investigators assessed that the airliner's fuselage was pierced by "high energy objects" - which could have come from the ground or the air. Prosecutors have said they are open to both possibilities but think it more likely the aircraft was shot down from the ground.
The Netherlands is leading the criminal and air safety investigations into the disaster, since more than two thirds the victims were Dutch. Investigators from Ukraine, Malaysia, Australia, Britain, Belgium and Germany are also taking part.
A spokesman said the safety board's draft report into the circumstances of the MH17 crash would probably be ready after the summer, at which point the other countries involved could make their own submissions.
The Dutch team will be under no obligation to change its report even if another country's authorities disagreed radically with its conclusions, the spokesman said.
(Reuters)
Media reports: German government warned of dangers before MH17 shootdown
Apr 27, 2015
The German government had intelligence indicating the danger of surface-to-air missiles in the Ukraine region where Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was shot down last year, according to German media reports.
Flight MH17, a Boeing 777, crashed July 17, 2014 during a scheduled flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur. All 298 people onboard were killed. Damage found on aircraft wreckage of indicated there were impacts from a large number of high-energy objects from outside the aircraft, according to a Dutch Safety Board accident report.
The Dutch report also said that three other airliners were in the area when MH17 crashed; one of them, a Boeing 777, was following MH17 on the same track and altitude.
Several German TV channels today released an investigative media reports claiming that German intelligence officials were concerned about the shooting down of an Antonov military jet just three days before the MH17 crash and made those concerns known to the German government. The intel officials believed the Antonov incident had potential safety implications for airliners that regularly flew routes through that same area, over a war-torn region. German media say the officials warned the German government of the potential hazard to airliners.
The need for greater collaboration and information-sharing over where it is safe to fly has been a key focus area of the ICAO task force that was created in the wake of the MH17 shoot-down. The task force wants to find better ways for government and intelligence organizations to share critical information that could help prevent another similar event and has drafted 12 proposals, including one calling for a global NOTAM system.
But getting governments and defense agencies round the world to provide that information is a difficult task. US director National Intelligence General James Clapper said last year at the AVSEC conference in Washington DC that he strongly supported the concept of multiple intelligence agencies working jointly together as well as vertically with organizations such as FAA, Transportation Security Administration (TSA) and the aviation industry. He has created a dedicated staffer reporting directly to him who is responsible for aviation security liaison. But he also warned that protecting intelligence agents and their technologies was essential.
New, sophisticated intelligence tools and greater cooperation across intelligence agencies is helping to get information on threats sooner. Clapper pointed out that it was these sorts of tools that enabled US intelligence to know within hours what had happened to MH17.
However, Clapper added, “We also have to protect our people and the sources of our tradecraft in order to keep using them. Our adversaries go to school on the lessons of our transparency.”
So, he explained, while he understood the call by the aviation industry for faster, even instantaneous information in the light of MH17, intelligence integration would be “a perpetual journey rather than a destination.”
http://atwonline.com/security/media-reports-german-government-warned-dangers-mh17-shootdown
Apr 27, 2015
The German government had intelligence indicating the danger of surface-to-air missiles in the Ukraine region where Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was shot down last year, according to German media reports.
Flight MH17, a Boeing 777, crashed July 17, 2014 during a scheduled flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur. All 298 people onboard were killed. Damage found on aircraft wreckage of indicated there were impacts from a large number of high-energy objects from outside the aircraft, according to a Dutch Safety Board accident report.
The Dutch report also said that three other airliners were in the area when MH17 crashed; one of them, a Boeing 777, was following MH17 on the same track and altitude.
Several German TV channels today released an investigative media reports claiming that German intelligence officials were concerned about the shooting down of an Antonov military jet just three days before the MH17 crash and made those concerns known to the German government. The intel officials believed the Antonov incident had potential safety implications for airliners that regularly flew routes through that same area, over a war-torn region. German media say the officials warned the German government of the potential hazard to airliners.
The need for greater collaboration and information-sharing over where it is safe to fly has been a key focus area of the ICAO task force that was created in the wake of the MH17 shoot-down. The task force wants to find better ways for government and intelligence organizations to share critical information that could help prevent another similar event and has drafted 12 proposals, including one calling for a global NOTAM system.
But getting governments and defense agencies round the world to provide that information is a difficult task. US director National Intelligence General James Clapper said last year at the AVSEC conference in Washington DC that he strongly supported the concept of multiple intelligence agencies working jointly together as well as vertically with organizations such as FAA, Transportation Security Administration (TSA) and the aviation industry. He has created a dedicated staffer reporting directly to him who is responsible for aviation security liaison. But he also warned that protecting intelligence agents and their technologies was essential.
New, sophisticated intelligence tools and greater cooperation across intelligence agencies is helping to get information on threats sooner. Clapper pointed out that it was these sorts of tools that enabled US intelligence to know within hours what had happened to MH17.
However, Clapper added, “We also have to protect our people and the sources of our tradecraft in order to keep using them. Our adversaries go to school on the lessons of our transparency.”
So, he explained, while he understood the call by the aviation industry for faster, even instantaneous information in the light of MH17, intelligence integration would be “a perpetual journey rather than a destination.”
http://atwonline.com/security/media-reports-german-government-warned-dangers-mh17-shootdown
MH17 crash: 'Old Buk missile used' - Russian firm
A Russian defence firm says an old Buk missile it used to manufacture brought down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over eastern Ukraine on 17 July 2014.
The Almaz-Antey firm said the Buk M1 guided missile was fired from an area south of Zaroshchenske.
The statement is in line with previous Russian claims that Ukrainian forces, not the rebels, fired the missile.
The destruction of MH17 - a Boeing 777 - killed all 298 people on board. Ukraine blamed the pro-Russian rebels.
There is controversy about who controlled the Zaroshchenske area at the time. The Russian military said the town was under Ukrainian military control, whereas Ukrainian officials insisted it was already held by the rebels.
Almaz-Antey said it had analysed shrapnel damage and identified the missile as "9M38M1 of the Buk M1 system".
The firm's CEO, Yan Novikov, said the missile was withdrawn from production in 1999 and "the concern and its companies could not have supplied these missiles to anyone in the 21st Century".
The wreckage fell in an area controlled by pro-Russian rebels. Ukraine and Western investigators suspect that rebels, armed by Russia, fired the missile.
Ukraine has denied Russian claims that Ukrainian forces were equipped with Buk-M1 missiles in that area.
International investigators say a Buk missile launcher was seen being driven through the rebel-held town of Snizhne only four hours before the plane was shot down.
'False images'
Last year Russian officials had alleged that MH17 was shot down by an air-to-air missile fired from a Ukrainian SU-25 fighter jet, but that theory was widely discredited.
Then, last month, a leaked report by Russian military analysts, published by independent newspaper Novaya Gazeta, said a Buk-M1 missile had brought down the plane, asserting it had been fired from Zaroshchenske, some 24km (15 miles) west of Snizhne. That theory was put forward by the Russian military as early as 21 July 2014.
Almaz-Antey refused to comment on who controlled the launch site at the time, but insisted that the Buk could not have been fired from the Snizhne area.
Mr Novikov said the firm was willing to stage "a full-scale, real-life experiment attended by independent observers and experts" next to a similar Boeing 777 fuselage, to reproduce the MH17 impact.
Russia's ministry of defence published pictures purporting to show Buk missile launchers near Zaroshchenske
On Sunday a forensic report by analysts in the Bellingcat research group said satellite photos presented as evidence by the Russian defence ministry had been falsified.
The images, published by the ministry on 21 July 2014, purported to show Buk missile launchers near Zaroshchenske on the day of the MH17 disaster.
Bellingcat says they were "digitally modified using Adobe Photoshop CS5 software" and the dates were altered.
Most of the MH17 victims were Dutch. The Dutch Safety Board will present its findings by October 2015.
Parts of the plane were found 8km (5 miles) from the main debris site
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-32972406?ocid=socialflow_twitter
A Russian defence firm says an old Buk missile it used to manufacture brought down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over eastern Ukraine on 17 July 2014.
The Almaz-Antey firm said the Buk M1 guided missile was fired from an area south of Zaroshchenske.
The statement is in line with previous Russian claims that Ukrainian forces, not the rebels, fired the missile.
The destruction of MH17 - a Boeing 777 - killed all 298 people on board. Ukraine blamed the pro-Russian rebels.
There is controversy about who controlled the Zaroshchenske area at the time. The Russian military said the town was under Ukrainian military control, whereas Ukrainian officials insisted it was already held by the rebels.
Almaz-Antey said it had analysed shrapnel damage and identified the missile as "9M38M1 of the Buk M1 system".
The firm's CEO, Yan Novikov, said the missile was withdrawn from production in 1999 and "the concern and its companies could not have supplied these missiles to anyone in the 21st Century".
The wreckage fell in an area controlled by pro-Russian rebels. Ukraine and Western investigators suspect that rebels, armed by Russia, fired the missile.
Ukraine has denied Russian claims that Ukrainian forces were equipped with Buk-M1 missiles in that area.
International investigators say a Buk missile launcher was seen being driven through the rebel-held town of Snizhne only four hours before the plane was shot down.
'False images'
Last year Russian officials had alleged that MH17 was shot down by an air-to-air missile fired from a Ukrainian SU-25 fighter jet, but that theory was widely discredited.
Then, last month, a leaked report by Russian military analysts, published by independent newspaper Novaya Gazeta, said a Buk-M1 missile had brought down the plane, asserting it had been fired from Zaroshchenske, some 24km (15 miles) west of Snizhne. That theory was put forward by the Russian military as early as 21 July 2014.
Almaz-Antey refused to comment on who controlled the launch site at the time, but insisted that the Buk could not have been fired from the Snizhne area.
Mr Novikov said the firm was willing to stage "a full-scale, real-life experiment attended by independent observers and experts" next to a similar Boeing 777 fuselage, to reproduce the MH17 impact.
Russia's ministry of defence published pictures purporting to show Buk missile launchers near Zaroshchenske
On Sunday a forensic report by analysts in the Bellingcat research group said satellite photos presented as evidence by the Russian defence ministry had been falsified.
The images, published by the ministry on 21 July 2014, purported to show Buk missile launchers near Zaroshchenske on the day of the MH17 disaster.
Bellingcat says they were "digitally modified using Adobe Photoshop CS5 software" and the dates were altered.
Most of the MH17 victims were Dutch. The Dutch Safety Board will present its findings by October 2015.
Parts of the plane were found 8km (5 miles) from the main debris site
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-32972406?ocid=socialflow_twitter
Missile maker says Russia did not shoot down Malaysian plane over Ukraine
The Russian company that makes the BUK air defense system that was used to shoot down a Malaysian airliner in east Ukraine said on Tuesday the plane was hit by a missile deployed by Ukraine and not widely used by Russia's military.
State-run Almaz-Antey said its own analysis of the wreckage of the Malaysia Airlines plane brought down on July 17 last year, killing 298 people, indicated it was hit by a BUK 9M38M1 surface-to-air missile armed with a 9H314M warhead.
Shrapnel holes in the plane were consistent with that kind of missile and warhead, it said.
Such missiles have not been produced in Russia since 1999 and the last ones were delivered to foreign customers, it said, adding that the Russian armed forces now mainly use a 9M317M warhead with the BUK system.
"Neither the company nor its enterprises could have supplied these rockets in the 21st century," Almaz-Antey's chief executive, Yan Novikov, told a news conference run by the Kremlin press service at which the company used 3D visuals and computer animation.
After a company presentation translated simultaneously into three languages, he said Ukraine's armed forces had still had nearly 1,000 such missiles in its arsenal in 2005, when it held talks with Almaz-Antey on prolonging their lifespan.
Criticizing sanctions imposed on Almaz-Antey by the European Union, he said: "The corporation was not involved in the Malaysian Boeing catastrophe. Correspondingly, the economic sanctions applied to the corporation for that are ... unjust."
When it imposed the sanctions on Almaz-Antey, the EU said the firm produced anti-aircraft weaponry which the Russian authorities have supplied to pro-Russian separatists fighting Kiev's forces in east Ukraine.
Moscow is trying to deflect blame for the shooting down of the airliner and denies sending arms and soldiers to support the rebels, though the West and Kiev say they have overwhelming proof of the latter.
Russian officials initially said flight MH17 was shot down by a Ukrainian fighter jet but that version was widely ridiculed abroad. They now say it was probably hit by a missile fired from the ground by Ukrainian forces.
Ukraine has denied its forces shot the plane down.
Dutch investigators who are leading an international investigation say their "leading scenario" is that it was hit by a Russian-made BUK.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/02/us-ukraine-crisis-mh17-russia-idUSKBN0OI1S620150602
The Russian company that makes the BUK air defense system that was used to shoot down a Malaysian airliner in east Ukraine said on Tuesday the plane was hit by a missile deployed by Ukraine and not widely used by Russia's military.
State-run Almaz-Antey said its own analysis of the wreckage of the Malaysia Airlines plane brought down on July 17 last year, killing 298 people, indicated it was hit by a BUK 9M38M1 surface-to-air missile armed with a 9H314M warhead.
Shrapnel holes in the plane were consistent with that kind of missile and warhead, it said.
Such missiles have not been produced in Russia since 1999 and the last ones were delivered to foreign customers, it said, adding that the Russian armed forces now mainly use a 9M317M warhead with the BUK system.
"Neither the company nor its enterprises could have supplied these rockets in the 21st century," Almaz-Antey's chief executive, Yan Novikov, told a news conference run by the Kremlin press service at which the company used 3D visuals and computer animation.
After a company presentation translated simultaneously into three languages, he said Ukraine's armed forces had still had nearly 1,000 such missiles in its arsenal in 2005, when it held talks with Almaz-Antey on prolonging their lifespan.
Criticizing sanctions imposed on Almaz-Antey by the European Union, he said: "The corporation was not involved in the Malaysian Boeing catastrophe. Correspondingly, the economic sanctions applied to the corporation for that are ... unjust."
When it imposed the sanctions on Almaz-Antey, the EU said the firm produced anti-aircraft weaponry which the Russian authorities have supplied to pro-Russian separatists fighting Kiev's forces in east Ukraine.
Moscow is trying to deflect blame for the shooting down of the airliner and denies sending arms and soldiers to support the rebels, though the West and Kiev say they have overwhelming proof of the latter.
Russian officials initially said flight MH17 was shot down by a Ukrainian fighter jet but that version was widely ridiculed abroad. They now say it was probably hit by a missile fired from the ground by Ukrainian forces.
Ukraine has denied its forces shot the plane down.
Dutch investigators who are leading an international investigation say their "leading scenario" is that it was hit by a Russian-made BUK.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/02/us-ukraine-crisis-mh17-russia-idUSKBN0OI1S620150602
Dr Gio
Utente Registrato
quindi, da quel che capisco dell'inchiesta abbiamo un po' di certezze in piu':
1. L'impresa russa le spara di tutti i colori pur di allontanare le colpe dalla loro creaturina (il missile russo)
2. I russi hanno fatto una figuraccia spacciando per vere delle immagini che hanno pacchianamente manipolato loro stessi con Adobe Photoshop 5 (bella pubblicita' per l'azienda americana, by the way)
3. Probabilmente la verita' non verra' mai a galla, almeno fino ad un cambio di regime, ops, pardon, volevo dire "governo" in Russia...
1. L'impresa russa le spara di tutti i colori pur di allontanare le colpe dalla loro creaturina (il missile russo)
2. I russi hanno fatto una figuraccia spacciando per vere delle immagini che hanno pacchianamente manipolato loro stessi con Adobe Photoshop 5 (bella pubblicita' per l'azienda americana, by the way)
3. Probabilmente la verita' non verra' mai a galla, almeno fino ad un cambio di regime, ops, pardon, volevo dire "governo" in Russia...
Permettimi di dubitare di bellincat visto che ci scrive uno che usa la frase slava ucraina tanto quanto dubito del ministro russo.
I
Crash: Malaysia B772 near Donetsk on Jul 17th 2014, aircraft was shot down
By Simon Hradecky, created Wednesday, Jul 1st 2015 16:18Z, last updated Wednesday, Jul 1st 2015 16:24Z
On Jul 1st 2015 the DSB announced, that the release of the final report into the crash of MH-17 is expected during the first half of October 2015. One year into the investigation, in compliance with ICAO requirements to provide a progress report one year after the occurrence, the DSB reported, that the draft report has been sent out to the involved parties on Jun 3rd 2015 for comment within 60 days, the board is then going to assess the comments and produce the final report.
http://avherald.com/h?article=47770f9d/010&opt=0
By Simon Hradecky, created Wednesday, Jul 1st 2015 16:18Z, last updated Wednesday, Jul 1st 2015 16:24Z
On Jul 1st 2015 the DSB announced, that the release of the final report into the crash of MH-17 is expected during the first half of October 2015. One year into the investigation, in compliance with ICAO requirements to provide a progress report one year after the occurrence, the DSB reported, that the draft report has been sent out to the involved parties on Jun 3rd 2015 for comment within 60 days, the board is then going to assess the comments and produce the final report.
http://avherald.com/h?article=47770f9d/010&opt=0
Source: MH17 report blames Russian missile
http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/15/politics/mh17-pro-russian-missile-crash-ukraine/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/15/politics/mh17-pro-russian-missile-crash-ukraine/index.html
Viking
Utente Registrato
Buongiorno all,
senza entrare nel merito di chi ha fatto o non fatto cosa, senza commentare i rapporti piu' o meno preliminari e piu' o meno definitivi che indicano che si l'aereo non c'e' piu'...senza accusare nessun regime ad est e ovest, ma mi chiedo: dove sono le VERE immagini satellitari? son sicuro che i satelliti di tutti stessero sorvolando la zona ed abbiano visto tutto. Che schifo di mondo. Non e' mai colpa di nessuno, intanto centinaia di persone son morte e con loro i parenti (nell'anima).
Vik.
senza entrare nel merito di chi ha fatto o non fatto cosa, senza commentare i rapporti piu' o meno preliminari e piu' o meno definitivi che indicano che si l'aereo non c'e' piu'...senza accusare nessun regime ad est e ovest, ma mi chiedo: dove sono le VERE immagini satellitari? son sicuro che i satelliti di tutti stessero sorvolando la zona ed abbiano visto tutto. Che schifo di mondo. Non e' mai colpa di nessuno, intanto centinaia di persone son morte e con loro i parenti (nell'anima).
Vik.
Per quanti satelliti ci siano nello spazio dubito che si possa avere una copertura dell'Ucraina (che è piuttosto grande) 24h su 24h, quindi non è assolutamente detto che esistano foto satellitari di quel preciso istante. Ad ogni modo dubito che vengano distribuite, questo per motivi strategico diplomatici.
- 10 Dicembre 2007
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Visto che l'area era tra tempo teatro di guerra, è molto probabile che uno o più satelliti abbiano ripreso l'abbattimento.
Purtroppo, per ragioni di realpolitik, è necessario che non emergano colpevoli "ufficiali". Perchè additare qualcuno ufficialmente, potrebbe rischiare di rendere incandescente una situazione già complicata. Per cui è probabile, almeno per ora, che nessuno paghi il conto per aver ammazzato quasi 300 persone.
naplover
Utente Registrato
Questo video mi fa rabbrividire, non solo il disastro aereo , ma penso che (io morto e le mie cose) nelle mani di chi potrei andare a finire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4zQKUVPfAQ&bpctr=1437133882
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4zQKUVPfAQ&bpctr=1437133882
TW 843
Senior Member
L'immagine (il fotomontaggio) che hanno messo in apertura rende bene l'idea della feccia che deve essere contenuta nell'articolo sotto. Articolo che ovviamente non ho letto.
Dopo un breve interessamento per questo sito, ho smesso di prenderlo sul serio.